When I was a young kid in school, I realized that I did things a lot different from the rest of the class. While they were all studiously paying attention in 8th grade math, I was doodling and wondering what they were all writing in their notebooks. In high school, I tended to dress a bit…different. I wore a trench coat before it was a symbol of murdering your fellow classmates. When it came to homework assignments and reports, I always worked the angles, making the rules bend just enough to make it work for me but still fit the professor’s parameters. In my senior year of high school, when I had to do a report and presentation on Virginia Wolff’s “To the Lighthouse,” I chose to do a multimedia presentation, showing how Wolff used diction (i.e., chose specific words and wording) to color her story, and compared the works to the art of impressionist painters. It was more of an art project than an English project, but it fit the assignment’s criteria. In college I took Medical Ethics in the 90s and then applied to the Registrar to have it count as a Science. The most scientific thing happening in that class was an existential conversation on the merits of cloning.
Yeah, I am a bit out there, always looking at things in a different light and working on ways to do the typical in an atypical fashion. Frankly, I just think my brain works a little differently. It’s part of what makes me a contrarian and why I gave myself the Devil’s Advocate of Poker Bloggers moniker, of course in half-jest.
So, excuse me if I came off as a bit chagrined when I was responding to comments on the most recent You Decide post. Where I analyzed the problem one way, the vast majority of you seemed to read it in a very different light.
If you commented on the You Decide but did not get a chance to read the most recent comments, please take some time out. NewinNov was kind enough to respond to my request, so he read the hand history and commented on what he was thinking during the hand. Clearly, he took some time out to give his explanation, so I’m very greatful. Also, its rare when you get both sides of a hand. Its the closest we can get to complete information.
Also in comments, PokerWolf asked me to elaborate about the difference between slowplaying and stringing your opponent along. The difference lies in your intentions. When you have a strong hand, like a flopped fullhouse or nut straight with no flush draws, you may decide to act like you missed the flop completely. When you are doing this, you goal is to get your opponent, who probably missed the flop, to either bluff into you or stay with the hand and hit something weaker later (or bluff later). Here is an example:
You are in the BB with A3h, and there is one limper before the SB completes. You check and the flop is Q72 of hearts. You have the nuts, and nothing can happen in the next card to change that. The chance of you losing the hand is very slim, but if you bet out, you might get no action. So instead you check after the SB checks, hoping to slowplay your nut flush. The limper decides to raise pot, and you only call. You are slowplaying, with the intention of raising late in the hand, hopefully after a big card hits for the limper.
In a situation like this, your goal is to get your guy to make a move on you, mostly, or at least to have him believe that you are weak so that when you pop it big later in the hand, he might call you (once that turned Ace hits his AKo, for instance).
On the other hand, you will face situations when the only way you will get any money from your strong (but ironically, vulnerable) hand is to price your opponent in. In a lot of situations like this, the prefered (and often correct) move is to bet big to push your opponent off of his draw or make him pay too high a price for his draw. However, it makes little sense to push an opponent out of a hand when the pot is too small to care about. First, he will likely fold since there isn’t anything worth playing for. Second, if he does call and that scare card comes, you will be in a tough spot playing for a decent amount of money.
In a situation like that, your best move is to keep your opponent in the hand on your terms. So, how can we do this? By betting amounts that will tempt any player in your opponent’s position. I’ll refer to You Decide #44 and NewinNov’s description of his thought process to illustrate.
After the flop, I have a set. I don’t know if New or the other guy have anything, but I do know that I’m ahead. I need to give a price that would get a call from a K-high hand, since thats the most likely way that they connected with the hand and would still be willing to call (i.e., 23o would connect with bottom pair but would never call a bet on the 3KA flop). With a pot of 60, there is only so much I can bet. It’s really 20, 40 or 60. 60 is pot, so I consider that too high to rope in a weak hand. 40 is 2/3 of the pot, so I decided on 20. This will keep it cheap for him AND me. Once the turn comes, I am still ahead and the pot is 100, so I need a price that will still keep an inferior hand in. 60 is a good number because its small-ish, but will continue to build the pot. On the river with 220 in the pot, 120 also seems harmless to someone on a marginal hand with no more cards coming.
Essentially, I’m trying to figure out what someone with a pair of Kings on a AK3/4/J board would be willing to call. It’s got to be low compared to the pot, otherwise he’ll just decide it isn’t worth it. I’m looking for a number where the K-high hand says, “Eh, why not?! It’s just $____ and he is betting weird so he might be bluffing or weak.”
Now, for all you people who missed it, this is what NewinNov had to say (excerpts taken from his comments):
“The flop bet of 20 is very suspicious. Alarm bells. You want to keep me around. You probably have an A with a better kicker or maybe a K but I sense you are playing around…Calling 20 to a 80 pot, 4:1, still very reasonable” Great! I’ve given him a broad range and a WTF play, so he is unsure, but willing to call a small bet.
“Any more than a $40 bet on the flop would have seen me fold.” Therefore, I lost 20 on this particular part of the hand, but I was correct that I had to bet small to keep him in (with an A20).
“The bet of 60 should have been my clue to leave as it was now getting expensive. But I didn’t because of the strange betting pattern and your loose image…your nice sized value bet made me want to continue for the implied odds…Anything more than 60 and I would have folded.” So, I priced this one perfectly. I couldn’t have gotten a single cent more from him. He knew it was high to call with his hand, but he called anyway because my bets were suspicious and confusing and it was just 60.
“With a clear head now, I don’t know why I called (the river bet of 120) except that the betting pattern confused me and the bet amount was just enough or the amount that someone would use with a King.” So, I complete the hand by making another suspicious bet that was cheap enough to call without crushing his stack.
Now, NewinNov also mentioned that at the end, he was willing to make the call because it would also advertise to the rest of the table that he was loose if he lost. I didn’t think of that at the time, but it makes perfect sense. In that regards, if I bet 220 (pot) or even 200, I think he would’ve folded. Maybe I could’ve gotten 180 instead of 120.
In total, then, I left about 80 chips on the table (20 from the flop, 60 from the river) at most. To me, slowplaying is like setting up a trap. Stringing your opponent along is more pro-active. On every decision, you have to figure out the most he will call, because you are never planning on springing a trap. You are merely leading them and their chips in the wrong direction.
Now, if an Ace came on the river, I was also golden, so there was an element of trapping/slowplaying involved. But I wasn’t going to give him an opportunity to check it down if he didn’t get his golden card. The key was to get the money while it was available to me.
I hope this helps out somewhat. Maybe I’m makign too much of the distinction, but I think that the two concepts are fairly distinct. Thanks for reading folks.
Until next time, make mine poker!



